Theories....come on lets play

Ian P
By Ian P Latest Reply 2009-03-25 20:23:39 -0500
Started 2009-02-26 13:17:19 -0600

I have been a member of this website for just a few days but have got a lot out of it already so I would like to just quickly thank all contributers for their input.

I find it hard to understand how when mankind can send people to the moon and make personal portable computers, with the capability of processing data in the blink of an eye that would have taken a whole building full of hardware a week to complete only 15 or 20 years ago, yet medical science cannot tell us exactly why we succumb to this condition. We know there are genetic predispositions and that certain things appear to trigger the immune system response to attack beta cells, but why isn't there a screening process to pre-empt the onset of the condition? With ever better genetic knowledge and knowhow surely family members of sufferers could be genetically screen to see if they are at risk, and if so monitored, that way any physical changes could be noted there by having a better understanding of the process and preventing the condition rather than treating the sufferers (an ounce of prevention is worth a tonne of cure). I am pretty sure that there is a good amount of market forces behind it all, imagine all of the money being made through test strips, machines, medication, specialist nursing staff, doctors, a whole world wide mini economy held up by us. It's kind of like the oil companies buying up alternative fuel ideas and keeping them under wraps so that everyone had to keep buying fuel and protect their profits.

I personally knew when I started, well before my diagnosis because I had an ache in my chest around my diaphragm, the doctor thought it was my liver and asked me if I drank alot, which I don't. After waiting several weeks for an ultrasound scan I was told there was nothing wrong with me, by a very indignant young lady. My doctor sent me for a fasting blood test, which I was informed a few weeks later, was no good because I hadn't fasted, but I had. I was ordered back to the hospital for blood test number 2 and fasted and was told a few weeks later again that the result was no good! I was given yet another form to take to the hospital for yet another blood test, I didn't go, I didn't need to. I knew what was happening, my grandfather had Type 1, my dad was type 2 and an aunt died from type 1, after 1st loosing a foot, then a leg, then her will to live (it was purely self inflicted she disregarded every bit of advice she was ever given).

That's my rant, do you have any insite into why no one is talking about prevention rather than an uncertain cure, or have you heard of any new treatments, apart from the seaweed coated pig cells, where do they get them from, really!!!?

14 replies

jsd2005 2009-03-25 20:23:39 -0500 Report

Prevention costs hospitals and clinics money. They make most of their money on outpatient testing. Once, you become knowledgeable you can refuse or accept any treatment you wish. That is your right. With my meter, i refuse to go to the hospital for a fasting and only use my meter. I also refuse many tests, unless it is something I cant do myself as it only costs money. Health care costs enough as it is.

Carol11 2009-03-03 10:08:50 -0600 Report

I was 60 when I was dx'd as type 1, the only one in the family although my mother is type 2. My theory at least with me, was the old bod just gave up. I was under tremendous stress at work, then I was put on overnights, this was Nov 06. My dad died Christmas Eve, more stress, I then developed what turned out to be pneumonia. Like I say the old bod just gave up.

MeiMei 2009-03-19 20:00:09 -0500 Report

Hi Carol, I was 59 when I was diagnosed with t1 also. It is a terrible thing when the body just decides to eat itself isn't it? Getting back to the general topic, conspiracy theories aside, I do believe there is a higher power controlling the health industry that promotes an illness based society instead of a wellness based society. Thanks to our Western medicine. I am more of a prevention person (although nothing could have been done to prevent my t1 I am finding) and am now embarking on a path more befitting the Eastern philosophies, yoga, taichi, organic foods, etc.

Pauline B
Pauline B 2009-02-28 23:59:30 -0600 Report

I diagnosed my own diabetes because I was aware of how my body felt after eating huge meals. I worked in a psych hospital (as food service director - professionally I am a nutritionist/home economist) so after a week or so of strange headaches I went to my nurse friends and told them of my suspicions. They got out a glucometer and tested my blood. We all went to the same doctor, and when the results of the blood test popped up, they said, "Are you going to call our doctor, or shall we?" They proceeded to frighten me." My doctor performed several other tests that proved what I had suspected. Type 2. This was over 10 years ago. If we had waited for a fasting blood glucose to show up, we would still be waiting. Wednesday I had an afternoon blood draw when I saw my internist. I was not expecting to have my blood drawn, and had been eating some caramel popcorn that also contained coconut and pecans. It was quite tasty, and definitely not on a diabetic diet. I only take 1000 mg metformin, twice a day. Lab results came back today: A1c was 5.6, and glucose was 99. If I ate a steady diet of rice, pasta, white bread, large portions, etc. glucose would have been higher, and my general health would be much worse.

I have been lucky to have had good doctors, no matter where I have lived, that took me seriously, and whom I trust.

What did you do when you came up with your diagnosis? Did you need any assistance from the medical profession for meds?

Ian P
Ian P 2009-03-02 19:12:58 -0600 Report

Hi Pauline,

I knew when my bloods came back wrong three times that I was diabetic and to tell you the truth I decided to ignore it,
I was slightly in denial I suppose. I waited until I was drinking up to 8 litres of water, over and above my usual daytime drinking, and I was going to the toilet probably 8-12 times in a 24 hr period 3 or 4 times during the night. I guess I decided that until I had the "full-on 110% you can't ignore me now" symptoms it wasn't worth seeing a doctor again. When I did go to the surgery my bloods were 432 and rose to 504 by the time I was admitted to hospital later that evening for observation.

2009-02-26 16:16:59 -0600 Report

Hi Ian,
I agree that this has become a world wide epidemic for a reason. I'm not a medical professional but I do a lot of research on Diabetes and other diseases. My feelings are that while Diabetes has been evident in all societies for centuries or longer (in ancient times they knew people had it because their urine attracted ants!! and of course they didn't have indoor plumbing back then so the deed was done outside hence the ants) , the current state of affairs in the world is primarily due to our lifestyle. (my opinion based on my research) I am in my early 50's and grew up with the advent of packaged, processed food… tv dinners were all the rage when I was a kid. All this processing and packaging required chemicals for added shelf life and fake ingredients to mimic the real deal. All of this for the sake of speed and convenience. My mother loved it and still does today at almost 80. Having lived in an era when you had to cook your own food she grabbed on to the idea and fell in love with it. She by the way does not have Diabetes but has heart problems. I had one uncle that was Diabetic (they think) and my father died at 45 yrs old so who knows, he may have had it too. I believe that the movement to return to local, whole foods, and cooking our own meals with out chemicals would be a blessing for everyone. If everyone joined in on this (but they won't because they don't want to give up their convenient life) we would see a 'recovery' period for some if not most of us. I'm talking about Type 2 patients as Type 1 is a different ball game altogether. So in order for this not to be a 'book' (haha), I will summarize my thoughts. Processed, chemical laden, prepackaged foods, lack of exercise. Not necessarily formal exercise plans just day to day activity. We don't even get up to change the television station anymore and we can record television with the touch of a button all from the comfort of our easy chairs. Our intelligence as a people brought about all the conveniences we have today but it also brought about other not so good things, like an epidemic of Diabetes along with convenience. We don't talk to our neighbors anymore, we talk to strangers on the computer. Our isolated, sedentary, chemical laden lifestyles contribute greatly to our illnesses.

So in the end was our intelligent discovery of convenient lifestyles worth it? A question that still puzzles me daily. My children are in their 20's and have always had a microwave, a computer, a remote control, cable tv… they know no different so to a whole generation this lifestyle is normal. I am frightened that they will become sicker with time as they don't or won't see the need to change. I myself have made the move to whole foods, exercise, and making a more natural lifestyle for myself and it has improved my general health overall. My A1C is 5.8, my weight has decreased by 55 lbs in the last year with little effort and I feel better and have more energy and I sleep better at night. So if this lifestyle can help one person, it can help others too. But how to get the message out to the masses is the difficult part. Will they listen, will they care? Ok so I wrote a book anyway… LOL

Just my opinion..

Ian P
Ian P 2009-03-02 18:55:34 -0600 Report

I couldn't agree more, personally my patner and I have been keen organic gardeners since childhood and we have both continued growing our own food since meeting in 1985. Now we have a family our 2 lovely girls have a full understanding of how food is produced, both animal and vegetable, and at 9 and 11 years help in the garden and are both capable of preparing and cooking substantial, healthy meals. They are also encouraged to participate in activities that stimulate and give them exercise.
The school that they attend isn't in the best of areas and it appears as though most parents feedtheir children for convenience only and I have been astounded at the lack of basic food knowledge that the local children of similar ages to mine have. My partner, Emma, runs an after school gardening club where the kids get a chance to grow fruit and veg in the school garden and she has made a point of trying to encourage some of the more troublesome and disadvantaged kids to attend. One child didn't even know what a potatoe looked like, and when Emma explained that it was where chips (fries) came from he said "nah, they come from Iceland (a freezer food store) in a packet", that is unfortunately true.
Subsequently when they grew some potatoes and carrots Emma made carrot soup for the kids and baked potatoes with butter and cheese on, although reticent to try it at first the young lad eventually tasted the food and said it was the nicest thing he had ever eaten, he now makes his Mum cook baked potatoes 2 or 3 times a week. Kids are not fussy or faddy eaters parents are responsible for their childrens eating habits. When my kids said they didn't like something I would say "okay leave it then" and carry on eating ignoring any other comments. Kids, from babies, don't know the difference between good attention and bad attention, all the know is am I getting attention or not so negative replies are only reinforcing negative behaviour. I always ignore bad behaviour, and praise the good. This is the same with food if they don't want it okay, my kids get praised for at least trying it and so they will eat almost anything and always try new foods.
That is the way forward, we have to be taught how to teach, only then will we start eating healthier. There endeth the lesson Tee Heee

Pauline B
Pauline B 2009-03-02 23:29:42 -0600 Report

I attended a lecture recently that was for professionals who treat diabetics where I learned that in certain areas in New Zealand where there are no fast foods, and everyone (Maoris) works hard to earn a living, eats traditional foods, genetically overweight, many are coming down with Type 2 diabetes. I just Googled to get my facts straight, and learned that New Zealand's problem with Type 2 presents similar problems with education and treatment as the US does with the American Natives. There is a certain distrust of being taught by "whites." An idea i heard in the lecture was that the increase in numbers of diabetes in these groups may occur for environmental reasons. I am still waiting for this research to show up in the journals, and to be repeated a few times.

rbergman 2009-03-02 23:43:07 -0600 Report

I'm Native American, yes, there is a direct genetic link in my own family of Diabetes, 5th generation myself. I live in an area of the state that is heavily populated with Native Americans, surrounded on 3 sides of this property by reservation land. To an extent, Pauline, you are correct, there are territorial lines and each tribe is different from the next as to what is expected as far as respecting boundaries. However, I have to disagree with you that it is the Natives that don't want the whites involved in their lives here, it is quite the opposite, whites fear the thought of crossing boundaries and therefore most choose not to do so, I have personally seen a vehicle of "white" people pull into a gas station on the reservation and as the man gets out to pump the gas the woman quickly locks the doors and looks around like she is expecting to be surrounded by Indians. There are many cultural differences just as there are many religious differences but to single out the Native American's as the untrusting ones is unfair, I believe it goes both ways from my personal experiences and from what I've witnessed. Please understand I am not condemning you personally as I understand you only stated what you "learned." But I believe that this idea is no better then saying because someone is of African decent they are bound to get HIV/AIDS.
(just my opinion)

Pauline B
Pauline B 2009-03-03 00:09:24 -0600 Report

I met no disrespect and certainly anyone who knows me would trestify to my having friends from everywhere. And I should have stuck with what I read rather than added my opinion. The report said that the Maoris were learning from each other how to deal with diabetes rather than from the authorities.

I lived in Alaska for several years. There are 5 major Native groups and many smaller groups each with their own language, customs, and traditions. In Sitka I overheard two Native Tlingit men gossiping about another man (an Elder but also an educator in a boarding school and to whom I reported as I was food service director for the school). The two men didn't like him because he had married a blond woman. In a later conversation I heard this same man happily boast that his Native group had invented a certain game though another coastal NAtive group (I cannot remember if it were the Yupiks or Inupiaqs) took all the credit. I realized that there was competition between these Native groups and I could not yet tell if it was friendly or not.

I am part Metis Indian myself, and want to learn more about that group.

rbergman 2009-03-03 00:44:39 -0600 Report

Please don't apologize, I took what you said as what you had learned and never once thought you had formed your own opinion about the mistrust issue being a factor. I thought I had worded my response to convey that and I am sorry if you got the wrong impression from what I said it was nothing directed at you personally or your opinion. I was going on what you had learned thus far, from what you were told.

I also wish you luck in tracing your heritage, it becomes harder and harder it seems for many to track it down these days, I was fortunate enough to have a lot of information passed along to me while I was growing up and I still ran into snags and gaps here and there.

rbergman 2009-03-03 00:49:40 -0600 Report

After re-reading my post, yes I did direct it at you when I said I agree and disagree with YOU, I'm sorry, that was my fault I should have commented more on the lecture and not at you like that, sorry again, I meant no disrespect to you either.

rbergman 2009-02-26 13:53:21 -0600 Report

I like your way of thinking. I had a relative that believed up until the day that he died that many of the diseases and conditions people suffer from were man-made, either intentionally or unintentionally, perhaps as population control, he also felt that childhood illness' such as mumps, measles and chicken pox were more helpful than harmful and that vaccinating against such illness' now does more harm than good.
I can't say i agree with the whole creating diseases for population control that he believed in, but I do wonder about the vaccinations causing more harm than good. I had all those childhood illness' when I was young, some of them more than once, now a days however, my children are vaccinated against all of them, when they came out with the chicken pox vaccination my first though was "What the hell?" Our daughter was given her first dose at jut 2 months old along with the other "required" 2 month vaccinations, our youngest son was 3yrs old at the time and we were told he too would need this vaccination. About 6 months ago we were told by our PCP that now they are recommending a booster chicken pox shot to those that had the 1st shot…I refused and she agreed she thought it was overkill as well.
We live in a chemically altered society and it only seems to get worse. Being native american I have some first hand experiences with the holistic natural remedies and cures that I have seen work personally on myself. At one point in my life they said gangrene was developing in my leg and that it would need to be amputated, I chose a different route and did leach and maggot treatments to rid my leg of the gangrene and it worked, I still have my leg, it ain't pretty, as they say, but I still have it. Too many times I feel the extreme "cure" is used when there are alternatives out there.
As far as finding the causes first and prevention would make more sense then waiting until it's too late and then just treat the problem. If I had known 20yrs ago what I know now about Diabetes, even though it was a predisposition in my family, I probably could have prevented it from happening to me, or at least put it off until later years. Diabetes has been detected as early as the late 1800's yet here we are over 100 yrs later and instead of fewer people getting it, it is becoming an "epidemic".
They can fix male impotence and can create drugs for women to have multiple birth pregnancies but they can't prevent life threatening conditions, much less cure them. I think instead of creating ways to further populate the planet they need to figure out how to take care of those of us already here.
The ages of Diabetes diagnosis' in my family are: 76, great great grandfather, 68 great grandfather, 71 grandmother, 46 father, 32 myself and 7 my daughter. Now I realize the predisposition was only a factor with our daughter and not the root of the diagnosis, but if you look at the ages of the rest of us you see that we each were diagnosed at a much younger age with each generation. I also find it odd that only 1 per generation seemed to be affected by it, why is that, why don't siblings have it? Maybe this is just the case in my family but I haven't read but maybe 1 person on this site talk about a sibling having diabetes too.
I know I talk about my daughter's troubles being caused by autoimmune failure…well that is true for all of us with diabetes, and I've read other people talk about other autoimmune failure conditions like my daughters Thyroid condition and allergies and now addison's disease. Why don't they do research to find what triggers the autoimmune to fail when the "usual suspect" reason's aren't the case? If it is the root of all evil, why not find that evil and stop it or destroy it?

Seaweed coated pig cells…contact lenses that monitor BG levels… embedded tattoo's…that all sounds great but how much did it all cost that could have been spent of getting to the root of the problem, not dealing with it in obscure manners after it's already begun.


Ian P
Ian P 2009-02-26 15:39:04 -0600 Report

Fantastic that is what I am talking about now you're thinking.
The maggots and leaches treatment is as old as the hills Only recently some so called ground breaking surgery including the use of leaches to stem coagulation during nerve fibre surgery and has been lauded as new a medical advancement when anyone with a modicom of historical interest knows that many civilisations, native americans amoung them, have had this so called advanced technology since standardised western medicine was examining humours and chicken entrails to diagnose disease.
I am starting to lean towards yoga and holiticism if not for recovery but for longevity, the body wants to heal its self, it just requires equilibrium. I am already glad that I started this topic thanks for taking part.

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