Dawn effect

By ChrissyRI Latest Reply 2012-08-21 11:46:58 -0500
Started 2012-08-10 07:19:46 -0500

I don't get it. So wait, if you do not have a snack at night you will wake up with higher bg levels in the morning? Anyone else had this issue?

57 replies

babysitting barb
babysitting barb 2012-08-21 11:46:58 -0500 Report

I have been having this problem since I was diagonosed in 2009. My doc doesnt seem concerned about it as long as the rest of my day is "normal". I take 2000mg of metformin and 20mg of Glyburide a day and always try to eat some protein before bed but I always have a reading of 120-160 in the morning. After I eat breakfast and take my meds it starts to come down. Wish I had an answer.

Armourer 2012-08-21 01:53:14 -0500 Report

I started eating a cup of air pop popcorn, spayed with butter spay pam, and the long term digestion makes for low blood BGs for me in the morning. Still have to inject. But better readings. Good luck.

Shelbo09 2012-08-15 23:37:22 -0500 Report

I'm not even a year into my diagnosis of Type 2, but I have this problem as well :(

My fasting blood sugars in the mornings are about 115-130 sometimes. I don't understand it. I've read about the liver dump, but I even try to eat something small before bed to make sure that doesn't happen. Yet it's still high. Haven't gotten control of it…just because I simply don't know what else to do.

Although I've noticed when I get really good sleep and wake up naturally, my fasting BS will be in the 70's or 80's. Usually during the week when I have to wake up at 8 in the morning for work, and I'm tired and sluggish, that's when my BS are 115-130. I wonder why that is? Is it stress? I make SURE to get at least 7 hours of sleep at night…so I have no idea.

Yet another hassle of this stuff!

GabbyPA 2012-08-16 10:29:45 -0500 Report

The stress of waking up on a schedule that is not yours can cause all kinds of things. I know when I am up a lot during the night, my levels are higher too.

Jim Edwards
Jim Edwards 2012-08-14 13:33:12 -0500 Report

Yes, but I have not a clue why. The midnight snack does not need to be big. Mine is often cheese on a craker.

ChrissyRI 2012-08-12 19:18:48 -0500 Report

Eh. Little bit. Told me my ear aches were viral… but I know once they start they turn bacterial so they gave me amoxicillan but that made me sick :( so im just waiting it out. Must be getting better, my sugar is somewhat back to normal now. I will say this much…diabetes is in a way clairvoyant - it lets us know something is up before we know ourselves lol thanks for asking :)

Jim Edwards
Jim Edwards 2012-08-14 13:40:16 -0500 Report

For future reference when taking an antibiotic also increase your eating of yogurt with active culturals. The antibiotic kills the good bacteria in your gut that helps youe processing plant to work. This yogurt (there is also milk with acidolphous (I know I don't have that spelled right) as well as capsules that will keep your system going. Hope this helps, Jim

Jccandals 2012-08-12 01:23:49 -0500 Report

Not for me but maybe its because my meds are taken with tabs prior to bedtime, so my snack is more imperative so that I wont have low blood sugars plus I work late nights

Nana_anna 2012-08-11 11:41:16 -0500 Report

For me, it doesn't matter. My BS is always up. No matter what I do. I have been sticking with my normal sandwich about 8:30p.m. Or a piece of fruit. I wake up to hight numbers. I think exercise helps it to stay down.

ChrissyRI 2012-08-11 10:33:29 -0500 Report

Somehow, for the first time in about a week, my bs was where it should be for fating this morn. Not sure what I did though.

dietcherry 2012-08-11 09:57:02 -0500 Report

I usually but not always have an after dinner snack (not dessert) to help to avoid hypoglycemia/liver dump during the night. If we eat dinner too late Im not able to eat anything else before bed and of course suffer higher BG in the morning :(

Set apart
Set apart 2012-08-11 07:10:51 -0500 Report

I usually have a snack to help with my liver dump and to make sure I don't drop too low while sleeping. The problem is that lately we've had dinner later than usually and am ready to rest an hour later, these are the days when wake a with a higher reading! :-(

Fedoue 2012-08-11 01:17:13 -0500 Report

You guys are great. I have similar problems. Your responses are so wonderful. Thank you.

CJ55 2012-08-11 01:10:34 -0500 Report

I think it depends on the person. As for me, I can wake up high after not eating for 10-12 hours, or it can be in the 30's. I never know. It is a guessing & testing game.

Diefleu 2012-08-10 21:54:11 -0500 Report

Also similar to the dawn effect you can actually take to much insulin run low while your sleeping and wake up high. This was happening to me. Kept taking more to lower my morning high until I realized what was happening. A tell tale sign that this is happening is waking in a puddle if sweat. Its a rebound hyperglycemia. Dawn effect is a natural problem where as this is more man made. Google: somogyi effect.

ChrissyRI 2012-08-10 22:02:54 -0500 Report

That doesn't sound fun :( insulin scares me. I hope I never have to use it. I know the reality is eventually I just may :(

jayabee52 2012-08-14 11:16:48 -0500 Report

I had injected myself for about 4 yrs, and insulin wasn't that bad. In fact I kinda became nabituated to injecting myself and then my 2nd wife also before she passed.

I was able to get off insulin and any other diabetes medications when I got serious about strict control of my meal plan (very low carb/high protein). I have been off of injections about 1.5 yrs now.

Lizardfan 2012-08-10 14:27:16 -0500 Report

Yup! have to eat a small protein~carb snack around 9pm to take my meds. If I don't eat or only eat carbs without protein I will wake up way higher that I like and stay out of range all day.

jayabee52 2012-08-10 13:47:42 -0500 Report

I had that issue when first Dx'd also. When I asked my GP about it he suggested that I take my Blood Glucose (BG) reading before bed and if my BG was below 130 to eat a snack containing protein. It worked for me, and I rarely wake up high now. Been doing that for about 14 yrs now.

Troope 2012-08-10 10:16:42 -0500 Report

I have similar issue. For those doing snacks before bedtime, what do you usually eat?

Nick1962 2012-08-10 11:54:04 -0500 Report

I usually go with protein - goes through the system slower. Hard boiled egg, leftover chicken, beef jerky, peanut butter on celery, almonds. Fo me if I have carbs before bed like bread, I have trouble getting to sleep. I had used protein shakes before I got my diet dialed in.

Just Joyce
Just Joyce 2012-08-10 20:45:57 -0500 Report

I do the same thing Nick but I omit the nuts. Last night I ate a piece of bread with butter and was fine. I normally don't wake up but once during the night. Then again some nights I am up at 2 in the morning watching tv.

Nick1962 2012-08-11 19:08:42 -0500 Report

I tend to stay away from breads because they aren't as long lived in my system. i don't like to eat when I first get up, so I go for meat or eggs. This keeps me at about 85 when I get up (6:15) and it will stay there, even through a cup of coffee until 9:00 or so when I first get hungry.

Just Joyce
Just Joyce 2012-08-11 19:35:25 -0500 Report

There are mornings when I wake up I feel like I am starving to death while other mornings I really don't want food. I discovered that if I am up later, I have to eat something before bed as opposed to going to be much earlier. Either way I need that cup of coffee in the morning.

Just Joyce
Just Joyce 2012-08-11 19:51:53 -0500 Report

I am up late playing words with friends, angry birds or watching tv. I am use to being up late. Worked 3-11 for years.

Nick1962 2012-08-11 20:31:35 -0500 Report

I've only gotten to work "banker's hours" the last 10 years, but before then it was every shift imaginable. I imagine that type of schedule would really mess up a body clock as well as BG's. Some days up at 4 am, others first going to bed at 4 am. Getting into a routine is well, to me boring, but helpful on the health. Saturday nights are still the late ones - lots of different music/concert events on TV.

yinghong 2012-08-14 11:07:02 -0500 Report

I had it bfore.. now ok dy.. eat a bedtime snack bfore u sleep.. i eat a piece of low salt cracker before i go to bed..

Nick1962 2012-08-14 11:24:24 -0500 Report

Yeah, I usually eat some type of protein before bed -chicken, peanuts, peanut butter on celery, and i don't have the problem any more.

yinghong 2012-08-15 07:34:17 -0500 Report

Chicken? Wont it be too heavy to eat before going to bed? How about make a cup of protein powder shake? Eg amway protein powder?

Nick1962 2012-08-15 07:59:31 -0500 Report

No, maybe just a chicken leg. The protein works through the system longer. I used to do a protein shake, but I needed to lose weight and the protein powders contained too many calories. I also try to avoid shakes and supplements (personal choice) because I can't take them with me all the time. When I travel, I need to be able to maintain a diet with what is readily available. I don't do carbs before bed if I can avoid them.

Nick1962 2012-08-15 10:13:48 -0500 Report

Supplements can be, but by the very definition of the word “supplement”, it is only “something added to complete a thing, supply a deficiency, or reinforce or extend a whole.”
If you are eating properly, you should be getting the necessary nutrition your body needs and therefore any supplement is just wasted. However, some foods these days simply by the way they’re grown (farm raised fish for instance) don’t supply the needed nutrition they used to. Some folks have deficiencies like Vitamin D, and take supplements for it. I have slightly high blood pressure and take fish oil for it because I would have to eat 3 lbs of fish per day to get the Omega 3 benefits I need. For me this is a natural alternative for blood pressure medication. I have full blood panels done every 6 months, and so far I have no deficiencies I need to supplement.
I have strong opinions on supplements. If you need them, take them. But I try to avoid treating them as food replacements. The body was meant to run on food, not pills and shakes.

MAYS 2012-08-15 09:45:16 -0500 Report

Supplements can't hurt you (maybe except for your wallet) but they are much more effective if you have a deficiency of a particular vitamin (or group of vitamins such as the b-complex family) or mineral, sometimes a closely associated componet to what is defecient can be the culprit, but either way supplementation cannot hurt you unless there is a negative interaction between the supplements and your prescribed medications.
Discuss any supplements and medications with your doctor and/or pharmacist!



yinghong 2012-08-14 11:09:33 -0500 Report

I had it before this.. now ok dy.. try to hav a bedtime snack bfore u go to sleep.. i eat a low salt cracker bfore i go to bed..

Caroltoo 2012-08-11 21:43:50 -0500 Report

I worked an all night shift last night. Haven't noticed a BG bump, but definitely have eaten differently today. Hoping the night shift person makes it in tonight.

Nick1962 2012-08-12 09:51:35 -0500 Report

I don't mind those once in a while, and do have mornings I need to be up and out by 5:00 am, but I don't think I could make it a habit again and still maintain control.

ChrissyRI 2012-08-12 09:59:36 -0500 Report

Lol you know. It is funny. I try to forget I have it and go about my daily routine (which includes testing and one metformin per day). It is times like these, when it is high in the morning, that I am reminded that yes I do have it, and that's just the way it is. Really tends to put a damper on my entire day sometimes. I am 37. I was never a big eater. In fact, part of this metabolic syndrome is because I didn't eat enough. My body stored the fat. First symptom was fatty liver disease. Then diverticulitis ( a direct result of not enough fiber and nutrients). Then it was weight gain. Then type 2 diabetes. I went 36 years without it. Ill be 38 in november. What a change it has been. I almost wish I had type 1 since adolescence. Might have handled it better. But all we can do is hang in there. You're all an inspiration. Thank you for that. We are all in this together. Buckle up, it is one heckuva ride.

Nick1962 2012-08-12 18:56:23 -0500 Report

Oh I know what you mean there! I've gotten to the point now that my diet is so routine, i don't test regularly - I know what i eat and what it does to my BG's. But then there are those little suprises like a client brings in an appreciation breakfast for the group, and it's like "damn, what do i have to do to rearange my meals to accomodate this". But i had a weight problem, so i can always use the "I don't want to get fat again" excuse.
I've had dieticians put me on 1200cal/day diets to lose weight and it had the opposite effect. Like you experienced, I went into the starve and store mode. I've really had little faith in dieticians/nutritionists since then.
Eventually, you will get to the point where you'll hopefully be off meds, and the BG won't be as big an issue, but yeah, sometimes I wish it were just like a headache - have high sugars, just take a pill. Speaking of which, not to pry, and if i may ask, but did the doctor help ay the other day?

Just Joyce
Just Joyce 2012-08-11 21:09:48 -0500 Report

I have not noticed that much of a change in my BG except for in the mornings. This was my worst week of the month because we had National Night Out and I was busy with that because two communities had their first event. Thursday I had a meeting and a Prayer Walk 3.5 hours later my BG's were low. I am an old black and white, western, action and adventure and drama movie watcher.

ChrissyRI 2012-08-10 10:37:34 -0500 Report

Good question. Lol. I was always told a 4oz yogurt, or half cup of ice cream. Never fruit. That's the advice the nutritionist gave me but who knows lol

jdla 2012-08-10 09:32:51 -0500 Report

That is how I became diagnosed initially. My fasting bg is usually 125-136. My A1C has been less than 5.9. Still working on controlling it. I take my metformin with my evening meal and that helps some. Wishing you the best.

ChrissyRI 2012-08-10 08:47:27 -0500 Report

Thanks Nick. My bg as wonderful until recently. Im actually at my dr now because on top of the higher readings, I've had a severe headache and ear ache for a couple of days now, which can also cause the numbers to rise. Sigh. I seriously hate having this.

Nick1962 2012-08-10 09:07:34 -0500 Report

Well, I hope he gets you fixed up. Yup, illness and stress can play a big part in those morning numbers too. I have those days that just suck too. Sounds like the best thing for you today would be to take what meds the doctor gives you, and go home crawl under the covers. Hope you feel better tomorrow!

Nick1962 2012-08-10 08:41:30 -0500 Report

Yup, this is pretty common and it's not just a diabetic thing. Often called liver dump. It's actually a result of fasting. Some glucose in your system gets stored as glucogen in your liver for release to keep you going if you haven't eaten. It's kind of your body's self preservation mechanism. After say 8 hours with no food your body think's you're trying to starve it and dumps this reserve in order to keep you functioning. This can also happen during the day.
Eating something at night gives your body fuel for the following hours to work with. If you eat dinner and nothing until the next morning, that could be up to 12 hours with no food, so once you get into the routine of bedtime snacks, you are telling your body "don't worry, I'm feeding you", and this will stop.
I used to wake up to 180 or better, now I'm pretty consistent at 86, even on those days I don't snack the night before.

CJ55 2012-08-10 22:37:57 -0500 Report

Hi Nick.. I was just going to open a discussion on .. What is Liver Dump. I usually eat somewhere between 5-7 pm. Then I don' t eat again until the next day. Sometimes 15-16 hours go by, then I will eat something. When I take my BS it is usually anywhere from 85 to 200. I would think.. Why so high, I haven't eaton anything for it to be high. I have been so confused. I guess I should have some protein at night. My endo did tell me if my BS is 100 or below @ bedtime to eat. She never told me anything about liver dump. Thanks for your posting. It makes perfect sense. Have a great day tomorrow. CJ \U+128515

Nick1962 2012-08-11 19:00:52 -0500 Report

Yeah, this baffled me at first too. Since i didn't have good acess to my PCP, and the support group I attended was a joke, I was pretty freaked out. I thought I was doing all the right things and BAM 220 when I had been below 110 the whole day prior. My chiropractor of all people explained it to me, and she didn't even know I was diabetic.
Have a good one yourself, and hey, go to bed for a change OK?

CJ55 2012-08-10 22:37:56 -0500 Report

Hi Nick.. I was just going to open a discussion on .. What is Liver Dump. I usually eat somewhere between 5-7 pm. Then I don' t eat again until the next day. Sometimes 15-16 hours go by, then I will eat something. When I take my BS it is usually anywhere from 85 to 200. I would think.. Why so high, I haven't eaton anything for it to be high. I have been so confused. I guess I should have some protein at night. My endo did tell me if my BS is 100 or below @ bedtime to eat. She never told me anything about liver dump. Thanks for your posting. It makes perfect sense. Have a great day tomorrow. CJ \U+128515

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